I don't have a whole lot to say about this song, it being the 3rd song ("Freeze Tag" and "Those Whole Girls" being the first two) I've found, as I've gone through, album by album, on this "songs" part of the 'Tow, in my quest to start discussions/threads for songs not yet having their own discussions/threads.

It's a decent enough song, by SV standards, anyway. ;) I hate to bring up things that maybe shouldn't be brought up, but this is definitely one of the more CURIOUS songs, at least whereas SV's sexuality is concerned, because, from what I remember, she actually has said that this was based on a real experience she had with another woman and that her ex-husband MF took more 'interest' in it than SV thought worthy.

Oh yeah?

Discuss -

-M

Oh,realy? cool!
This is a funny song, and the clip in mooncusser is a real bunch of laugh! If you haven't seen it yet go and check it out!

The Line "do you know where friendship ends..." happens to be so useful for hilarious purposes among friends in parties!!

i myself find it revealing that, in "the passionate eye", what comes after this song's lyrics is the text called "on masculinity", where suzanne talks about what is perceived as masculine and feminine, and what it is to be sexy, for her.

and this 'chapter' begins with "as girls go", and ends with the text mentioned above, with "naked" (a poem), the text "on being photographed", "plain" (poem), "book & a cover" and "modesty" (poem) in between.

"i prefer to believe that in our hearts and minds, we are more similar than not" (suzanne dixit).

love,
fátima

just two more thoughts to clarify my point: the album this song belongs to is about desire, in its broader sense. desire is what makes *everyone* act, even if it's by omission. without it we *all* would just stop moving.

if i remember it correctly, suzanne also said that, when she wrote this song, she had in mind the possibility of a man singing it as well, just like evan dando (and the lemonheads) did with "luka". so, in its origin, "stockings" could be about a she or he addressing a she. in each case the lyrics are one and the same and they fit. desire is desire is desire. "we are more similar than not".

love,
fátima

I would like to deliver my own theory :-)

Yes, dear Fatima, "desire is disire is disire" and "desire is what makes
*everyone* act", but...

There is always this who loves and this who is beloved. It seems to me that there is "original" disire and "derivative" disire. It happens sometimes that the woman knowing that someone in her surroundings is a lesbian, she seems to feel disire for her. This may be "derivative" desire and is connected sometimes with the will of conquering and a new challenge. The same happens according to me when someone is interested in you. You may be surprised that the "friendship ends and passion does begin" so fast in that case. The most interesting and unambiguous is the "original" disire.

I can only agree that we are similar in groups. Changing the topic a bit, there are people who have suicidal thoughts, are tired of life and, on the contrary, there people hungry for life, new challenges and many adventures. I doubt if they are similar except they are human beings...

love,
Anna Maria K.

---

"like a shadow, I am and I am not"

PS. I came up with a metaphor. People are like language and communication. Everyone uses the same words, but delivers something else. There are some styles and so is with feelings and personalities. We experience the same feelings, love, passion, anger and at this level of rigorousness we are the same and feel the same, but our styles are different.

love,
Anna Maria K.

---

"like a shadow, I am and I am not"

dear anna,

i believe the point we're both trying to make is, at heart, "similar, if not the same". and your PS alone proves it.

love,
fátima

well i just only discovered this song a few days ago thanks to the mooncusser site.
Now I cant get it out of my head, and all i can say its, its a bloody good song !
I love it.

I re-discovered this song recently, that I had found a bit 'light' at first - meaning the subject seemed to me rather personal and I did not feel involved in.
But, although I don't know why (and nothing of the sort happened in my own life), the words

Do you know where friendship ends
And passion does begin

make a queer effect on me. I love humming those words to myself, as if there was a great pleasure in voicing them, and I hear the bass theme behind at the same time like another voice softly playing with Suzanne Vega's. There's a great sensuality in the sound of the words themselves and the music that I can't explain but felt only lately.

By the way, as an afterthought, I love the idea of discovering that the game of desire may sometimes overwhelm you and you just realise it too late; you're in a strange ambiguous relationship, not only with the other person but also with yourself, surprised that you didn't see it coming at all. And at the same time, somebody 'inside' just looks at what's happening and laughs at you.

But maybe I'm wrong. That's only the way I feel this song now.

Well I don't if I talked about it before (prolly I did) but I felt a strong connection to this song the moment I heard it.

Those particular words you quoted, Cantabile, that's a very real-life question. The border between spiritual and physical attraction is often so very vague and ambiguous that it confuses you. At least, it confuses me at times. What if you feel only one of the two, and start confusing one with the other, or what if they coincide? Complicated. That's why I like listening to this song and ponder on it, and imagine myself with others in the situation the song described.

Spikes.

Yeah, certainly. When I said it hasn't happened in my own life, I meant with somebody of the same sex.
But the song can clearly be heard in a more general way (and I believe SV said so, but don't remember where). And there, yes, I do agree with you. It does happen quite often when friendship lasts enough.
However, I feel that it is less frequent now that I'm no longer a young man though not being old yet - well, I'm in my 40's in one word. It did happen a lot when I was younger, say till my 30's, and guys and girls where kind of looking for themselves.
It's not only because most of my friends and I are married, with children and all, but also because we found ourselves in some way, so that what we are looking for in people is clearer in our minds I guess...

But maybe it's only me. Can't say...

I've always assumed that the song was from a male point of view. Kind of instinctively, actually, as I'd never thought much about it. But I really like the ambiguity in that song. It's always been one of my favorite songs from this album. Very sensual and evocative, and the music itself is just gorgeous. And the phrase "Do you know where friendship ends and passion does begin" is haunting.

melanie:

I've always assumed that the song was from a male point of view.

 

How funny, to me, the narrator is surely female. I remember how I "appreciated" it that Suzanne made a song about friendship/passion between two women. (After having a look at male transvestites in "as girls go")

I don't know if I remember it correctly, but I think Suzanne once said that her former husband said something like "Is there anything I should know....???" to her after listening to this song/reading the lyrics... ;) 

Nothing much (not much),

Moni. 

moni:

How funny, to me, the narrator is surely female. I remember how I "appreciated" it that Suzanne made a song about friendship/passion between two women. (After having a look at male transvestites in "as girls go")

That's one interesting thing about that song, how differently it can be perceived. And it's interesting whichever way you understand it. Almost as if it were two different songs in one.

Just in case that wasn't clear: I don't mean that I'm convinced that the narrator is male, only that I perceived it that way and never really thought about it. Did Suzanne ever comment on the subject? I don't think I've ever read anything about it.

The only comment I know is the bottom of this page: http://rustedpipe.vega.net/stockings.htm